This, basically, is why I hate Open Source projects. Of course, I hate paying bloated prices for bloated commercial software, for which I have to pay for more hardware upgrades to run as well.

Which, basically, is why I hate computers.

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probably end up doing this too

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Dude, don't you know? It's open source. That means you aren't supposed to file bug reports, you're supposed to look at the source, fix it, and resubmit it for them!

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... and then they get to laugh at your patches and reject them!

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At the very least, I got a good chuckle...

Sounds like he needs a good kick to the dome..

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...the fuck!?

No, really, what the fucking fuck!?

They had a lot of nerve calling you rude and then flaming you for not being glued to the download page for the last two weeks.

At least you got a reply to your bug report, though. I never heard a word.

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Oh man. I needed that laugh.

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Send them a patch.

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Like maybe a tire patch, for their arrogant droollpit?

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Are these people really this rude generally? Or is it some kind of inside joke that I don't know about.

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Over-compensation for being replaceable by a dozen Indians, perhaps?

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Strange. I used to work for the same company as Sven and met him quite a few times, and he's always come across to me as a nice guy; but I think he's making a mistake here. On the other hand it would be interesting to know if other strategies than escalating rudeness were more effective with dealing with strange attitudes from open source developers.

It's odd that people see this as a problem with open source; on my planet, closed-source software mostly sucks *even* *worse* - the chances of rudeness are lower, but so by far are the chances of helpfulness, and timewasting is far more likely.

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The last comment to the bug seems to be the most helpful. You'd think the first guy could've just said, "We've resolved a number of memory leaks since that version. Try the latest development release and see if it reoccurs?"

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32767. That's a good one. I should remember that.

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So are all programmers such utter cocks?

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The industry term we prefer is "void pointers".

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yet another reason why gimp will never seriously compete with photoshop.

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Havent they ever heard of automated profiling and debugging?

I'm a big fan of Insure++.

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It would soil their open-source purity.

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hehe, at least they replied. I still have a bug report open for xfree86 where x crashes anytime one attempts to run anything gl related (i.e. glxinfo / glxgears, etc). After aprox. 1 month of waiting for at least a 'this is a known issue, you suck read the documentation' or similar, i switched over to xorg, which amazingly the problem disappeared.

and amazingly with some cvs drivers for dri, dri worked too- which it didnt under xfree86.

anyways, yea i like gimp but ive noticied that gimp 2.2 is quite a bit more sluggish than the 2.0 series.


And, seeing as 'jwz' is nearly a house-hold name in the geek community, youd think they would at least add a little more respect to their replies.
One has to wonder if it is a result of you being you that you got that reply, or does he treat everyone like that?

perhaps you just have another person who is upset about rude/obscene screensavers that are not fit for academia work

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LOL, its screensaverism! Fucking bigots!

Yeah, seriously, when I read that I was SHOCKED that someone would treat jwz like he didn't know how to debug.

I knew who he was ever since netscape put up an employee web page directory. What was that? A century ago? What hole have these people been hiding in all this time?

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I think it's reasonable to expect that people know that "development" releases are mainly for use by developers, and are expected to have many bugs. And if you're using development releases to do real work, you're not going to get much help unless you basically dive in and debug most of the problem yourself. Yes, including downloading the latest release of five seconds ago and testing it.

I fail to see anything remarkable about this. You didn't think when you started using the .0 version of a development track of an open source project that you might end up here?

Totally unrelated: The First Avenue Massacre

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He wasnt asking for help, he was contributing useful information to the developers. They rejected it out of hand, without even checking into the problem.

Like, if you dropped $20 on the ground, and I picked it up and handed it to you, and you said "fuck you, I dont want it", that would be analagous to this situation.

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I, for one, welcome our new rude opensource developer overlords...

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yeah, damn those pesky gimp developers for making such stable releases and fixing bugs so quickly. damn them to hell.

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seriously, if you're going to report a bug in a development tree of something, you have to expect to rebuild it frequently. It doesn't really do much good to report it in one that's a month outdated. It's not like you have to reboot your computer to use a new version, and it's not that big of a deal to check the FTP site for a new version.
If you had reported a bug in a development version of the Linux kernel that was a month old, it'd probably be ignored.

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While I entirely understand your point, can you see how being a Dickhead (TM) isn't helping anything?

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Do you ever have good experiences reporting bugs or interacting with open source people?

I realize that wouldn't make an interesting post, but considering the level of flaming you get for what seem to be reasonable requests, I'm curious if you ever get a reasonable answer in return.

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Actually, my bug-reporting interactions with the Gimp folks have generally been above average (excluding the current example, of course.) In that, I report bugs, and often they get fixed. As opposed to Gnome in general, where I report bugs, and two years later they are closed because "all that code has been rewritten from scratch." Or X, where I report bugs, and they get closed because "fixing that would be difficult."

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I can say with some authority that developers can be real assholes. This just reinforces my opinion that developers really, really shouldn't speak to customers.

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Try talking to OpenBSD people for a bit...

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Look, if the first answer was "yeah, probably a leak, we don't care about leaks in this version yet", I could totally accept that. But that's not what the answer was. The answer was "it's rude of you to have reported this bug at all, because that code is two weeks old." And that's just a totally ridiculous response. There was nothing rude about me reporting a bug; I was not asking for help, I was trying to help them.

What's the result of that kind of response going to be? I'm gonna stop reporting bugs, that's what, because why should I try and help someone who's just going to yell at me for it?

Developers are supposed to want people to report bugs. If you don't want non-developers to have access to a branch, don't link to it from your damned web site.

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You are correct, he is wrong.

Ignoring the value of your bug report for a moment, we can think of it from a public relations standpoint. You go out of your way to help them with their project (best intentions, to be sure) and are rebuffed. Nowing this, will I ever submit a bug report to the gnome people? Of course not. I have better things to do than filling out bug reports to be yelled at. Even if they found your bug report unuseful, or maybe it had already been fixed or something, they should kindly thank you for taking the time to fill out the bug report, and to please do so again in the future.

To give credit where credit is due, one of the best bug-report related people I've dealt with has been Ryan "icculus" Gordon, who has done many video game ports. I've entered many bug reports and because he is always nice and genuinely helpful, I will continue to do so.

That's how I see it, anyway.

-cb

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you're obviously an idiot lamer who doesn't know anything about software development, and is just using OSS cause it's cool. go back to Windoze.

. . . . . . . .

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haha. It's been ages since I've seen the word "lamer".

Do not taunt jwz, he will hzXXor j00!

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Besides the puzzling choice of "rude behaviour", I'm not sure Sven's reply was that big a deal. Of course, he could have added a note about the stuff mentioned later and then all would have been good. Maybe he read your bug report following a dozen useless ones had just worn his patience thin?

At any rate, while unhelpful, his reaction doesn't seem to justify making that big a deal out of it. Schumacher's reply admittedly is completely superfluous, but then, I'm not sure your retort to Sven to which Schumacher is replying sets a shining example either.

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